Craps betting strategies dont pass bar

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I always want to be in the action and making some kind of bet between rolls. I find myself pressing my bet if I get unlucky when making the don't pass bet at the come out roll. I just take full odds on whatever the total ended up being. I was really enjoying having the don't pass and making two or three additional bets and seeing what would happen.

I would stop and just see if the board would clean up I'm just not sure if I was being counter productive by making come bets and taking odds after I had the don't pass out there. Make a don't pass and a don't come bet, and then place the 6 and the 8. That should be plenty of action, and all are "good" bets. I prefer to just play the don't and lay odds.

Another wager I like is to just "lay" the 4, 5, 9 or It always makes me more conservative and under control Good change of pace for me My issue with the don't is that by laying odds you are actually making the current bet worse. What I mean is that if you make a don't pass bet - and then survive the come out roll - at that point in time you have an advantage on that bet 7 is more likely than the point. By laying odds the advantage goes back to the house.

Same thing for the third point. Then I wait to see if those numbers will repeat, or the seven beats them to it. I do not lay any odds since it has no advantage for me, but the higher don't pass and don't come bets retain the dark side advantage. When the table is icy Odds bets have no advantage for either the house or the player. They are neutral and have no advantage for either side. All great crap players should know how to play with and against the house, laying odds is not a big deal since the house usually wins most of the time.

Qdogpa - I am absolutely NOT saying forgo odds on don't bets. They are exactly the same bets on the don't as they are the do. The house has no advantage on either bets, they are still "free odds" bets. The difference is you lay the odds on the don't bets. You should always take the odds on all of the pass and come bets on a craps table.

That is the only bet in the casino that has no house advantage, and that is the same for the "do" and the "don't" bets. I'm with you on this. Once I have the don't pass bet out there working I find myself much more aware than if I go with the pass. In a way I just am far more mindful of the seven than if I don't have the bet out there. If I bet pass line I have a very hard time stopping at two come bets. I tend to want to just keep betting come bets and hoping for a very hot shooter.

Skip to main content. Log in to get trip updates and message other travelers. Watch this Topic. Browse forums All Browse by destination. Las Vegas forums. All forums. Level Contributor. Report inappropriate content. Related: What are the most popular tours in Las Vegas? See all. Best Seller. There are times when you know it's a cold table and you want to make don't come bets. You do so, but the shooter always seems to throw an early seven.

You lose the first DC or a push results on your second DC. When that happens I start to bet the following way. I wait three rolls before making any DC bets. This gets you past the early seven. Just make two DC bets. If your first DC is a 4 or 10, lay odds and don't make anymore bets. This method uses flat bets with no added odds, except on the don't pass when you are making a don't come bet.

Here's how it works. The next roll is You would now remove the odds bet on the don't pass. By adding the odds bet to the don't pass when making a don't come bet, you are insuring a win if a 7 is thrown, instead of just breaking even. Reprinted from an article in Chance magazine , with permission from the author, Larry Edell.

Visit his site at Thecrapshooter. Bet only on Come out roll, bet Wrong. Bet on 10 and after the come out roll remove your bet. If 7 comes you win. You lose only if 10 comes. He will give you 50 for Say you bet Wrong on 4 and 10 for each lay bets on Come out roll. If he does not roll 4 again you will get your lost Then restart. Variation- Bet on 10, if he rolls 10 then don't bet again, wait until he is done with the roll.

Bet on the next shooter. Come out roll only then remove the bet. Works best on cold tables. Don't pass chase. I wait for the current shooter to seven-out, then I place a don't pass bet. If I lose, then I chase the bet. If the current shooter gets me again, I chase one more time at 2. Most casinos I've been to, the players rarely hold the dice to three point or instant winners.

Maybe someone else will verify my results. I will call myself the dark sider for obvious reasons; Answer these simple questions first. What's the most powerful number on the table! What number has the most probability to come out the most! What number does the casino have on their side which enable them to make huge profits!

Bet if the 11 is rolled. The lay bet lets you bypass the seven on the come out roll. It will lock up a profit when you 7 out. If it's a field number just keep making those bets. From this point on, you must play with the 3 f's feel, finesse and fortitude sense and knowledge is a must. Get to the table your on. You want to bet against a shooter making 4 consecutive passes.

Maintain your bet level when and for as long as you win. You keep betting at this level until you lose. You can change this system to Don't by 3 and adjust the bet amount to what you are comfortable with. First I look for a table where a player is making a don't come bet and then they take it down off the number that was rolled.

Then I ask that player if I can pay him the amount of the bet he is taking down. This way I don't have to worry about losing the bet in the don't come box before it gets established. The house has an 8 to 3 edge over me when I have money in the don't come box, but once the DC is established I have the edge. I've had great success by playing this way. The only bad thing about playing this way is it takes time to win a small amount of money.

But it's the only way to have a little edge over the casino. Be sure the lay bets are working on the come out. Come out roll is a 4. Lose the no 4 bet and the yo. Remove the no 10 bet and place full odds on the don't pass bet and hope for a seven. Come out roll is a 6. Six becomes the point. You lose the yo. I will share a play that is about the best way you can play it and it is against all books and advise of play, as you always advised to add odds, here you only add odds to replace losses.

Rules to follow: 1. Table should be 10x's odds or better, the higher the better. If crap leave up for double bet no add of 5. Try it and if you have any questions I would be glad to answer them. Believe me this is important, as you can lose some important replacements. Have fun. Its hard to do on wincraps as it takes off the bet before you can see what you had on it, at the crap table you have enough time to see it. I use beat the house the older version, not the real old one though as that only 2x's odds.

You might need mostly on a 5x"s table, never and 20 prob never but could happen on 10x's table. What's good about this is that you are only loaning out the money and when a 7 shows, which it will , it all come back. Make a DP bet then lay single odds. Keep betting on that shooter until he: a makes his point 2 times without throwing any naturals 7 or 11 b or rolls a natural, followed by any combination of 2 more naturals or 2 more points for a total of 3 losses.

The idea is to stop betting on a shooter wants he starts beating you, then wait for the next shooter. I've had great success with this method of play. Comments are welcome. Unknown contributor. My buddy and I have been playing a don't pass martingale and been doing very well.

The key to this, that you can't put a math equation to the human factor that every shooter will have some great rolls and maybe make 8 or 9 passes on that one hot shoot, but to make a one pass eight different times you get the dice, PLEASE, PLEASE!!!!! I've never seen it done.

I've got 3 other buddies that go to the casino with us once in awhile and they have not been able to run me out of eight levels either. I've read several books about the martingale and they hate it, but they play consecutive rolls and I've seen 14 passes by the same shooter then the next time he got the dice GUESS what??

The main key to this is having a team of buddies who will not leave the table till everyone is cleared. You can't play the guy down at the end of the table in the red hat because he might beat you 2 or 3 times then leave the table so you have no chance to clear the bet on him.

I don't need LUCK with this style of play just the human factor or dynamics of the game as I call it. Don't Progression, regression. If the shooter throws a 7 on the come out, you lose the DP but win the lay bet. The lay bet is your hedge and acts as odds for your DP. If he makes the point before a 7 out, you lose your DP but still have the lay bet working. If he sevens out early, you win both bets.

Same idea. There are many good "ladder" systems for the pass side using place bets, but for most of them to work and show a consistent profit throughout a session, each player would have to hold the dice a minimum of 15 minutes. It's not going to happen. They have a habit of showing up on cold tables along with a lot of other crap. Then make a DC bet. Open the table yourself and shoot for as long as you are the only player.

When others join the game pass the dice I no longer shoot with other players at the table. Talk to you later shooter yahoo. Anyone who has a basic understanding of the game, already is well versed in the true odds of any number being thrown and knows that short term streaks happen all the time. This approach to winning at craps relies on that probability and will work if patience and discipline is utilized a very high percentage of the time.

Each shooter will be given 4 chances against your bet. Also included in this series is the fact that the come out roll gives the shooter a chance to win automatically by throwing a seven, 6 ways or a 11, 2 ways with only a 2, 1 way and a 3, 2 ways , that will cause the shooter to lose and you to win. The 12 1way is a loser for the shooter, but a push for you. You just wait for him to eventually seven out before you begin the series again with the next shooter.

You stop betting and wait for the shooter to seven out. When the dice pass to the next shooter you begin the next series. Also if you win any of the bets in the series, then the following will apply. I said at the beginning that there are no sure fire systems that will give you a positive edge and this approach is no different. However, the odds of you losing at this approach are extremely high. It can happen and has happened, but it is rare. This really puts you in the red very quickly and digging yourself out will take a long time of standing at the table.

It might be prudent to just take your losses and find another table. The choice is yours. I tried this approach for a week on my computer simulator at home before venturing to the casino.

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Players who wager on this bet are known as "wrong" players since they are usually betting against the shooter who is a "right" player. You are hoping the shooter doesn't pass their dice on the pass line. If you place a bet on the don't pass bar sometimes known as bar 12 , you are essentially betting that the rolled dice will land on 2, 3 or 12, which is when you win.

In contrast, you would lose if the dice land on 7 or Note that some casinos will not let you win on a Instead, if the dice roll on 12, the wager results in a draw or a push and your money is refunded. If you roll one of the other craps numbers such as 2 or 3, then you win an even payout or odds. Also, the actual odds of the winning this bet are , so this is very close to the payout. The small difference here is known as the house edge, which is 1. Note that this is mathematically the best craps bet you can possibly do besides the additional don't pass odds bet, which will reduce the overall house edge to almost nothing.

I displayed a screenshot of the bet below to give you an idea of where this is on the craps table layout. You will lose if a 7 or 11 is rolled. The important thing to notice is that the number 7 comes up more frequently than any other number. In order to activate the odds bet, you need the shooter to roll one of the point numbers 4, 5, 6, 8, 9, Remember that the odds of rolling any point number is better than the odds combined of rolling a 7 or Once the point is established, a player may make bets in multiples of your original line bet such as 1x, 2x, or 3x.

Note that in big casinos like Atlantic City and Vegas, players have the opportunities to wager 10x, 50x and even times the original bet on the odds bet. The free odds bet pays out true odds. Though they still have an edge on your original line bet. The rule to remember is that the more money you wager in odds bet, the lower the house edge gets overall on your total bet.

The don't pass line has a 1. Adding on a don't pass odds bet will decrease that percentage even further. Note that you win both your don't pass odds bet and don't pass bet or don't come odds bet and don't come bet when the dealer rolls a 7 before the point number, which is more likely than the point number and benefits you even more. I added a picture to make things a little clearer and I will explain it below.

First I made a don't pass line bet and the shooter rolled a 10, which became the point number indicated by the "ON" disc located on The dealer then moved my chips to the "don't pass" area of the 10 section in the craps layout. If the dealer rolls a 7 before a 10, I will win both bets.

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Joined: May 5, Threads: 32 Posts: Joined: Nov 2, Threads: Posts: First off, the difference in the house edge is minor, so tradition plays a big part in it. Part of it comes from the way the game is introduced to newbies. If you attend one of the casino's free craps lessons, they will start with the basics: pass line and odds. Then they'll talk about how a come bet with odds is just like a pass bet, but after the point is established.

Then they'll talk about the place bets, and finally the field and hard ways, because they're popular and simple. They'll mention the Dont's as well as the prop bets, but they'll do it in a way that suggests that they are advanced concepts, and a newbie should get familiar with the basics first.

The other part comes from the fact that a wrong side shooter will retain the dice when he loses. Who wants that? So the tradition is to be a right side shooter. And players generally will bet WITH the shooter. Or at least with the dice, which means right side betting. I think the fact that dark side is also called 'wrong' actually has very little to do with it.

For what it's worth, a few months ago, there was a discussion here about creating a craps game that favored wrong betting. The single change in the game would be that the shooter lost the dice when he MADE a point.

A LOT of people liked the idea I invented a few casino games. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? Tiltpoul has two great points. Proof: Blackjack that pays and double zero Roulette. There IS something to say about the energy created by a hot shooter. You do so, but the shooter always seems to throw an early seven. You lose the first DC or a push results on your second DC. When that happens I start to bet the following way. I wait three rolls before making any DC bets. This gets you past the early seven.

Just make two DC bets. If your first DC is a 4 or 10, lay odds and don't make anymore bets. This method uses flat bets with no added odds, except on the don't pass when you are making a don't come bet. Here's how it works. The next roll is You would now remove the odds bet on the don't pass.

By adding the odds bet to the don't pass when making a don't come bet, you are insuring a win if a 7 is thrown, instead of just breaking even. Reprinted from an article in Chance magazine , with permission from the author, Larry Edell.

Visit his site at Thecrapshooter. Bet only on Come out roll, bet Wrong. Bet on 10 and after the come out roll remove your bet. If 7 comes you win. You lose only if 10 comes. He will give you 50 for Say you bet Wrong on 4 and 10 for each lay bets on Come out roll. If he does not roll 4 again you will get your lost Then restart. Variation- Bet on 10, if he rolls 10 then don't bet again, wait until he is done with the roll.

Bet on the next shooter. Come out roll only then remove the bet. Works best on cold tables. Don't pass chase. I wait for the current shooter to seven-out, then I place a don't pass bet. If I lose, then I chase the bet. If the current shooter gets me again, I chase one more time at 2. Most casinos I've been to, the players rarely hold the dice to three point or instant winners. Maybe someone else will verify my results. I will call myself the dark sider for obvious reasons; Answer these simple questions first.

What's the most powerful number on the table! What number has the most probability to come out the most! What number does the casino have on their side which enable them to make huge profits! Bet if the 11 is rolled. The lay bet lets you bypass the seven on the come out roll. It will lock up a profit when you 7 out. If it's a field number just keep making those bets. From this point on, you must play with the 3 f's feel, finesse and fortitude sense and knowledge is a must.

Get to the table your on. You want to bet against a shooter making 4 consecutive passes. Maintain your bet level when and for as long as you win. You keep betting at this level until you lose. You can change this system to Don't by 3 and adjust the bet amount to what you are comfortable with. First I look for a table where a player is making a don't come bet and then they take it down off the number that was rolled.

Then I ask that player if I can pay him the amount of the bet he is taking down. This way I don't have to worry about losing the bet in the don't come box before it gets established. The house has an 8 to 3 edge over me when I have money in the don't come box, but once the DC is established I have the edge.

I've had great success by playing this way. The only bad thing about playing this way is it takes time to win a small amount of money. But it's the only way to have a little edge over the casino. Be sure the lay bets are working on the come out.

Come out roll is a 4. Lose the no 4 bet and the yo. Remove the no 10 bet and place full odds on the don't pass bet and hope for a seven. Come out roll is a 6. Six becomes the point. You lose the yo. I will share a play that is about the best way you can play it and it is against all books and advise of play, as you always advised to add odds, here you only add odds to replace losses. Rules to follow: 1. Table should be 10x's odds or better, the higher the better. If crap leave up for double bet no add of 5.

Try it and if you have any questions I would be glad to answer them. Believe me this is important, as you can lose some important replacements. Have fun. Its hard to do on wincraps as it takes off the bet before you can see what you had on it, at the crap table you have enough time to see it. I use beat the house the older version, not the real old one though as that only 2x's odds. You might need mostly on a 5x"s table, never and 20 prob never but could happen on 10x's table.

What's good about this is that you are only loaning out the money and when a 7 shows, which it will , it all come back. Make a DP bet then lay single odds. Keep betting on that shooter until he: a makes his point 2 times without throwing any naturals 7 or 11 b or rolls a natural, followed by any combination of 2 more naturals or 2 more points for a total of 3 losses. The idea is to stop betting on a shooter wants he starts beating you, then wait for the next shooter.

I've had great success with this method of play. Comments are welcome. Unknown contributor. My buddy and I have been playing a don't pass martingale and been doing very well. The key to this, that you can't put a math equation to the human factor that every shooter will have some great rolls and maybe make 8 or 9 passes on that one hot shoot, but to make a one pass eight different times you get the dice, PLEASE, PLEASE!!!!!

I've never seen it done. I've got 3 other buddies that go to the casino with us once in awhile and they have not been able to run me out of eight levels either. I've read several books about the martingale and they hate it, but they play consecutive rolls and I've seen 14 passes by the same shooter then the next time he got the dice GUESS what??

The main key to this is having a team of buddies who will not leave the table till everyone is cleared. You can't play the guy down at the end of the table in the red hat because he might beat you 2 or 3 times then leave the table so you have no chance to clear the bet on him.

I don't need LUCK with this style of play just the human factor or dynamics of the game as I call it. Don't Progression, regression. If the shooter throws a 7 on the come out, you lose the DP but win the lay bet. The lay bet is your hedge and acts as odds for your DP. If he makes the point before a 7 out, you lose your DP but still have the lay bet working.

If he sevens out early, you win both bets. Same idea. There are many good "ladder" systems for the pass side using place bets, but for most of them to work and show a consistent profit throughout a session, each player would have to hold the dice a minimum of 15 minutes. It's not going to happen. They have a habit of showing up on cold tables along with a lot of other crap. Then make a DC bet. Open the table yourself and shoot for as long as you are the only player.

When others join the game pass the dice I no longer shoot with other players at the table. Talk to you later shooter yahoo. Anyone who has a basic understanding of the game, already is well versed in the true odds of any number being thrown and knows that short term streaks happen all the time.

This approach to winning at craps relies on that probability and will work if patience and discipline is utilized a very high percentage of the time. Each shooter will be given 4 chances against your bet. Also included in this series is the fact that the come out roll gives the shooter a chance to win automatically by throwing a seven, 6 ways or a 11, 2 ways with only a 2, 1 way and a 3, 2 ways , that will cause the shooter to lose and you to win.

The 12 1way is a loser for the shooter, but a push for you. You just wait for him to eventually seven out before you begin the series again with the next shooter. You stop betting and wait for the shooter to seven out. When the dice pass to the next shooter you begin the next series.

Also if you win any of the bets in the series, then the following will apply. I said at the beginning that there are no sure fire systems that will give you a positive edge and this approach is no different. However, the odds of you losing at this approach are extremely high. It can happen and has happened, but it is rare. This really puts you in the red very quickly and digging yourself out will take a long time of standing at the table.

It might be prudent to just take your losses and find another table. The choice is yours. I tried this approach for a week on my computer simulator at home before venturing to the casino. A couple of times I got buried in the beginning and had to play forever to get even, but I did get even and was able to then make a profit before cashing out.